Talk:Geochronometry

Nanocycles method by S Afanasiev

I have in my possession a book in Russian which translated is called "Nanocycles Method" by S Afanasiev, Prof of Geology at Moscow University. It has references to studies in salt mines that determine very long strata dates and find certain cycles present. Afanasiev finds that the cycles are due to lunar orbital variations and as the lunar orbit is known rather accurately determines an accurate calibration system. As far as I know this method is unknown in the English speaking world. When I applied it to the Elatina formation cycles presented by G Williams, it shows that the several cycles present are exactly what are expected and accurately dates the formation. I would be happy to write something about this, but when I did so in wikipedia it was deleted because the people there had not heard of it. Of course they hadn't, it is in Russian. RayTomes 01:07, 30 January 2007 (CST)

Ciao RayTomes. I know about some uses of lunar cycles in geology. Tidal sediments as those of the Elatina Fm. are the most obvious case (though the original interpretation was that laminae were annual, if I remember it right. Later, the researcher who studied that case changed his mind. I can check in my biblography if needed). Lunar cycles are also recognized in sclerochronology of molluscs, and were used to constraint parameters as the Earth-Moon distance and lenght of the Day in the geological past.

Thus, this method is not completely unknown outside Russia, only, it has limited applications. I never heard of its use on salt crystals, though, and I'd like to know how it works.

Of course you are welcome to contribute here. Please cite and try to make the method clear. I'll try to expand your section with an explanation of other similar methods.

Add your name to the Authors of the Earth Science Workgroup if you contribute.

Cheers! --Nereo Preto 01:48, 30 January 2007 (CST)

You are right that the original assumption was annual layers and then it was later decided that they might be monthly layers relating to lunar periods. However this is not what I am referring to. The Nanocycles method assumes that they are annual layers and that the pattern of periods in these varves are caused by very long term changes in the lunar orbital motion as a result of tidal action slowing the earth and making the moon more distant and therefore orbiting more slowly. This causes cycles to be present in varves and second order cycles as the first order ones interact with the seasons and so on. There is a unique pattern to the observed periods and modulations that is confirmed in the Elatina results. You will not find this in and English language papers. RayTomes 18:38, 3 February 2007 (CST)

One of the things to bear in mind is the no-original research policy. I dont think it applies to your ideas but you need to be aware of it. The Russian work is existing knowledge I expect David Tribe 03:10, 30 January 2007 (CST)

Yes, I have met Afanasiev at a cycles conference attended by about 500 people in Stavropol in Russia. He was elected leader of the geology section and was quite clearly well respected. His work is published and also builds on others who first found these patterns in the salt deposits where very long sequences have allowed the lunar orbital changes to be mapped. It amazes me that so much knowledge exists in Russia on this amoung many people and yet it is unknown in the west. I guess that you can tell that I am not a geologist, but an interdisciplinary cycles researcher. RayTomes 18:38, 3 February 2007 (CST)

Ok, I never heard of this scientist, but this is quite tipical for russians (they had their own isolated science for years, and they often come out with great stuff anyway). It is known there are long-term cycles in the tide record, at scales down to thousands of years, and a very-long-term trend (millions of years), so the story makes sense. If you don't know where to put your text, put it in my talk page. I'll try to figure out what article it belongs, I may add some geological staff around it and post. My idea is, start contribute, editors (that is, me) will eventually fix if there are problems. As long as you cite your sources, I can't see any problems. Ciao! --Nereo Preto 09:59, 4 February 2007 (CST)

Thanks Nereo, I will do that. Might take a little while though. RayTomes 20:46, 4 February 2007 (CST)